Altered States: How Important is Intact Status to Social Skills?
A recent interaction on a social networking site clued me into the fact that not all dog geeks know about things they may not have personal experience with. I believe this subject to be important enough to repeat some information from past blogs. So while this particular blog isn’t specifically about multiple dog households, it is about multiple dog interactions and therefore applies to multiple dog households as well.
Those of you who have followed my blog have seen mention of this topic before; especially, if you have been tracking the saga of Kenzo’s neutering. Mixing intact males and neutered males is a social setting can be tricky when the goal is interactive play.
While there are no scientific studies to support this subject, I expect that many behavior professionals have come across this particular quirk in their careers. Many a client has commented to me that their own neutered male “doesn’t like intact males”. Science, while wonderful, isn’t studying every subject so it behooves is as behavior junkies, to learn from other sources as well, such as observation and repetition of occurrences.
Now those of you who have never had the opportunity or the right circumstances to see such an issue for yourself may wonder what this consists of. The manifestation can vary according to the dog. I have a former class student who’s neutered male screams and stands on his back feet when he gets the close by scent of an intact male. This happened once with a dog in class owned by a friend, who I knew had just been neutered so we assumed that the surgery was simply too fresh. I later learned that said dog had a cryptorchid testicle so the hormones had not fully been removed. The reacting dog had been right!
I have been witness and a hearsay recipient to such occurrences for the entire length of my dog behavior career so it surprised me that not every behavior savvy individual had been exposed to this. But when pondering how frequently the occurrence actually happens, it makes sense to me.
You see, not all neutered males are threatened emotionally by an intact male. My sweet Merlin had no issues at all with any dogs he interacted with unless they were rude to him. Even then, until he reached his senior years, his fuse was long. Intact or altered, it was all the same to him. We had literally dozens of males come through my house as foster dogs, mostly arriving needing snipped. Interactions were pleasant all around. But Merlin was a confident dog for his entire life, sure of his place in the world, even as a puppy.
However, Trent, my Pit Bull is a different story altogether. He is very insecure, despite being very loved and cared for and having a secure life. He is on anxiety meds and has come very far with his issues but will likely always be insecure of his place in the world. Yet until Kenzo started reaching sexual maturity, I never noticed that he was among the neutered males affected by intact males. He never reacted any differently when out and about or having intact foster dogs in the house. But Kenzo stayed and was raised here and grew bigger and bigger in front of his very eyes. It became very clear that Trent felt increasingly threatened by him, although nothing that Kenzo did was at fault.
I have already chronicled what transpired with Kenzo’s social group visits with increasing frequency as Kenzo matured more. So I won’t repeat myself. But what I will do now is describe it further. The moment we entered the room with the other dogs, a dog or two, who would turn out with questioning of the owner, to be a neutered male, would rush over and snark at Kenzo’s face, trying to nip at him both in his face and around his face. The owner and I would interrupt and send the dog elsewhere and he (or they) would come back targeting just Kenzo again. The owner(s) and I would have to be continually on top of this for the entire hour long social. It was exhausting. So I stopped attending until Kenzo was neutered.
Other clients have told similar tales from either an off leash walk in the park or a visit to the dog park. Intact dogs are typically not permitted at dog parks but many people don’t abide by rules and most dog parks are not supervised by an authority figure. Anyone can bring their dog, well behaved or not, intact or not, to most dog parks. There is an assumed risk there. So while there is almost always some sort of a disagreement between dogs at a dog park, most people don’t ask questions to determine why. In many cases, it is the intact/neutered male equation at play.
What does this all mean in the whole scheme of things in the dog world? Well, as previously mentioned in many blogs, I am very pro-altering for the majority of the American dog owning world. Disagreements about the health pros and cons of either point of view aside, the behavioral aspects of having an intact male in a world of neutered males is an important consideration. If you have no plans on having your dog be social with other dogs up close and personal ever, then you have no worries. If you are a behavior professional and qualified to deal with the potential aggression directed towards your intact male, then go for it.
But if you are just a loving dog owner who doesn’t want to have to become a behavior expert just so that your intact male dog can safely interact with your neighbor’s neutered male dog, then just make the appointment for neutering. Why punish the intact dogs by neutering them when the true issue lies with the insecure neutered male dog? Well, I don’t see neutering as a punishment. Unless you are a responsible breeder or showing your dog (in which case you probably do have the skills needed to handle this correctly!), then I just don’t see the need to keep a dog intact. I expect that statement to anger many people. I am sorry if it does but that won’t make me change my mind on the subject.
In conclusion, the stakes are just too high to take the chance of leaving your dog intact, in MOST cases. So feel free to offer your opinions, POLITELY phrased, in the spaces below, on both sides of the issue. I especially want to hear from those who have experienced their own dog aggressing at intact males. Play nicely in the sandbox people!
I am not a regular reader- just happened to stumble in here while searching for something else, but I was very interested in this topic. I had already read a snippet about the problems between intact and neutered males in Whole Dog Journal, so I was already aware that there can be problems. Your post caught m eye because I am currently dealing with these problems. We have an almost 5 y.o. neutered Golden and an almost 4 y.o. intact ACD. The Golden loved the ACD as a pup and was the only one in my multi-dog household who was willing to play with the little heathen. When the ACD matured sexually, they started snarking at each other and have continued till now. I am not actually sure if the Golden snarked first, but it is definitely the ACD who keeps it going now. He is the primal heathen at its finest- he eats poop, snatches birds out of the air to eat whole, and is still concerned with our two BC’s lady parts and they too have been spayed for ages. The ACD was kept intact as a show dog and at the request of his breeder who really loved his breeding. I liked your remark about although you’re a professional trainer you didn’t want to have to be always on at home. I feel very much like this, and I am embarrassed that while teaching others how to train their dogs, it looks like my own pack is trying to kill each other. We are talking about approaching the breeder with our desire to neuter the ACD, but I am concerned that now the behavior is ingrained.
The other oddity is that our 5th dog, a neutered male Sheltie, is the ACD’s best buddy. They get along beautifully, and even if the Sheltie snaps and grumps because the ACD is too rough or steps on him, it’s no big deal. I had expected a relationship more like this with the Golden. We’d raised a previous intact Golden with a neutered male Border Collie and never had a moment’s trouble (granted the BC was the MOST confident dog I’ve ever met!) I always figured the trouble was between intact males– grew up watching that happen in our Sheltie breeding kennel as a kid.
I’m just wondering if neutering the ACD at this age will actually help anything???
I have 4 dog’s, 2 female Rottweilers ages 6 yrs and 2 yrs. And 2 intact males….one Rottie and one pit bull.
The male Rottie is 2 years old and I’ve had no issues with him as far as aggression with other dogs. He’s very easy going, was easily trained and I’m a militant NILIF.
My male pit is 6 months old and will be neutered very soon. He isn’t dog aggressive YET, but he is a little rough, and I can see him being pushy.
That being said, I personally believe much of it has to do with training and boundaries. Not that there might not be a pre disposition there, but my house, my rules, and the dogs know what’s expected of them.
They don’t eat until I say ” ok” , dont walk through doors before people and while they are allowed on furniture the second I say off,they move as if they are on fire!!
Darkstone, neutering may take the edge off, but I suggest really vamping up NILIF.
Thank you for this insightful information. I have a three year old intact male American Bulldog/Pit bull. He has always been friendly, gets along well with other dogs big and small and for the most part will happily ignore barking or aggressive behavior from other dogs. My boy weighs 96 lbs and that’s with being on a diet, and vigorous exercise regimes. Lately I’ve noticed while at the dog park, that he wants to mount other dogs, this is a brand new behavior he is exhibiting and as soon as he does I correct the problem. I’m on the fence about fixing him because the vet states that he will get bigger, and at almost 100 lbs this worries me. I only weigh 50 lbs more than my dog, and although he is well trained and behaved I’m worried that extra weight will be too much for me. I have severe medical issues that he helps me with, and I’ve had him since he was 6 weeks old. I don’t have problems on our walks, just recently at the dog park with the mounting issue. I would appreciate any feedback regarding my issue, and if not taking him to a dog park eliminate this problem I’m OK with that as well. Please help because I don’t want to be a bad dog owner, nor do I want to jeopardize my dog or any other dog for that matter. I never thought an intact male would create insecurities in other dogs.
Thank you for putting that so eloquently. I think it’s hard for people to understand this isn’t a blame game but a safety issue. I own a one and a half year old neutered Male who was rescued from Puerto Rico as a puppy. He loves going to the dog park and loves playing rough with his friends but also knows how to play gently with little guys. He can be very vocal when playing especially with dogs bigger than him. Hes gotten in a couple scuffles but he doesn’t start them. But if he suddenly just goes after a dog growly and snarling it’s always a young intact Male. But some intact males hes gone with. It’s frustrating because I dont want anyone to get hurt and he has really good bite inhibition. But if I ask the other owner if their dogs not neutered they become defensive. My goal is simply to understand his behavior and correct it. It’s just a shame because no one wants to take responsibility or help others to find a safe solution
I have a 2-year old intact male boxer. He is well socialized, and well-trained, but this has been an issue for him as he has matured as well – certain males take issue with him, and they are typically very insecure males, typically younger in age. He’s very patient for the most part with it, but he does need me to be on watch with him with insecure neutered male dogs. The ladies love him, spayed or not – there’s never an issue there. I cannot alter him as he has a heart defect that makes anesthetizing him impossible. I am still seeking other alternatives via a local theriogenologist. There are sometimes medical reasons involved, and I’d like to see the US adopt more alternatives to just a traditional neuter.
I will never understand if there is a posted “rule” that dogs have to be spayed or neutered to use the local dog park why so many people don’t think rules apply to them. It is your choice to neuter or not but if you don’t understand that was YOUR choice and don’t bring your intact dog to a dog park.
Agreed!